Darréll Brown talks environment, economics, and running for District 28 state senate

"Creating jobs is great, but if you're creating jobs at the expense of the community, particularly bringing in a polluting facility - that's not a good job."

Darréll Brown is running in a five-way race for state Senate District 28 (Providence, Cranston), a seat being acted by Joshua Miller. The race will be decided in the Democratic Primary since there is no Republican in the race. Also running are Melissa Carden, Bernice Morris, Lammis Vargas, and John Crok Jr. Brown describes himself as “a lawyer, environmental advocate, and experienced leader in economic development, and longtime Edgewood resident.”

Candidates interested in scheduling an interview should reach out.

Brown invited me to interview him at his home in Cranston on Friday morning. The interview has been edited for clarity.

Steve Ahlquist: My big question is how does economic development square with environmental justice? Especially at this time when we're doing citywide strategic plans in Cranston, Providence, and across the state. That's my big question, but I'll be getting to that in due course, I want to prepare you for it.

Let's start with an introduction. Have you run for anything before? And why have you chosen to do it now?

Darréll Brown: I've not run for public office before. public office and why am I doing it now? Do you remember when Pete Buttigieg came to Rhode Island and he stood on the Washington Bridge and he was talking about getting federal dollars to fix the bridge? That day on that bridge, the federal delegation was there, the governor was there, and the mayors of East Providence and Providence were there. The mayor of Cranston was not there, and there was no local representative from District 28 there. As residents in District 28, we are impacted by the bridge closure because traffic is backing up on Allens Avenue up here to Narragansett Boulevard, bringing in more pollution and noise. The community is frustrated with it and so am I.

When I saw that there was no representation there that day, I said to myself, “Either they're not paying attention or they don't care enough to be there to represent our interest” I sensed that they didn't care enough. So I decided then that if I had the opportunity to run, I would. Then Josh Miller surprised me when he decided not to run. He called me because I've known him for a while. He called me and said he thought I'd make a good candidate and should consider running. I told him that I would consider running. I didn't make up my mind to run until after I checked with my wife and I wanted to check with CLF [Conservation Law Foundation] to make sure that CLF was cool with it. And they were fine. CLF can't endorse me, but they're very supportive of me doing this.

I also wanted to check myself to make sure that I would be fully committed to doing this. Not only running a campaign but fully committing to representing the folks in District 28. It's a big commitment and I take all my commitments seriously. I'm a former prosecutor and I swore an oath. I take this in the same way. I would have to swear an oath if I were elected as a state senator. It's a huge commitment and it's one that I'm ready and prepared for.

Steve Ahlquist: As an aside, Senator Miller hasn't endorsed anybody in this race, and I don't think he's planning to from what he said to me at your first candidate forum.

Darréll Brown: I've heard him say that there are good candidates in the race.

Steve Ahlquist: He told me that, yes.

Darréll Brown: He has his reasons. I don't know what they are, but he has his reasons. I have received the endorsement of former Cranston City Councilmember and mayoral candidate Steve Stycos. Representative Arthur Handy (Democrat, District 18, Cranston) also endorsed me.

Steve Ahlquist: Rep Handay is known for being a strong environmental voice.

Darréll Brown: I also received endorsements from Cranston Forward and Climate Action Rhode Island.

Steve Ahlquist: Your district overlaps Providence and takes up part of the Port and Washington Park.

Darréll Brown: Almost the Port. My district ends at Save the Bay.

Steve Ahlquist: I'll tell you, when I stand in front of Save the Bay and I look at the bay, I think, “This is beautiful.” If I look to the right, it's beautiful. But if I look to the left, it's a nightmare.

Darréll Brown: It's a nightmare

Steve Ahlquist: Whatever is going on to the south, with the sailboats and nice houses and whatever is being directly impacted by what's happening in the Port with the cement mixing, chemical storage, metal fires, and other polluting industries. Not to mention the smell. You must get that here sometimes.

Darréll Brown: I do, yes.

Steve Ahlquist: We are all affected by these polluting industries, but it's also about the highway going through there. With the bridge out, traffic sits there and idles endlessly, affecting the lungs of the community around the Port. Some of these trucks have nothing to do with Rhode Island. They might be delivering goods from Virginia to Maine.

Darréll Brown: The director of transportation [Peter Alviti] should be paying attention to that. And he isn't.

Steve Ahlquist: At the candidate forum you called for his resignation.

Darréll Brown: I said if I were elected state senator, I would call for his resignation.

Steve Ahlquist: That's interesting because it's the Senate and that continues to confirm him.

Darréll Brown: That's right.

Steve Ahlquist: And the Senate President seems to adore him. That might cause immediate friction with Senate leadership if you’re elected. There seems a consensus among people, if they're honest with themselves, that Alviti is not doing a good job.

Darréll Brown: He's not doing a good job. And if that were to create friction should I be elected? I support the Senate President but I do not seek to get elected and go along to get along or to be told what to do and what not to do. When I was living in DC I had the unique ]experience of getting my hair cut at the same barbershop as John Lewis. Every time he got out of the chair, we would have little conversations. But always, at the end of his conversation, he would say to me, “Darréll, get into some good trouble.” That would be my intent in going to the State House.

I intend to go there, get into some good trouble, and make a constructive and systemic change that will benefit the folks in District 28. I'm not there to be a part of the club. First of all, that's just not my style. That's not my makeup. I don't do that and I never have, so why start now at 60 years old? Should that create friction, that's not a bad thing. Especially when 80% of the folks in the district think that he's doing a terrible job.

Steve Ahlquist: Leadership in both the House and the Senate love to get their majority in line. They want all the Democrats to vote along with them. You will have to make a strong case.

Darréll Brown: And I will. I'll make a very strong case.

Steve Ahlquist: In my mind, environmental justice issues are the point of the spear when it comes to doing something about climate change. We can't stop climate change and have places like the Port acting the way it does. We can't stop climate change by putting all the misery of petrochemical storage on one tiny community.

Darréll Brown: Why can't some of that go to Quonset?

Steve Ahlquist: I don't know why all of it can't go to Quonset. Not as many people live in Quonset as live here in Providence.

Darréll Brown: Exactly.

Steve Ahlquist: I don't understand why Shell doesn't just move to Quonset. There's plenty of land around there.

Darréll Brown: Exactly. Here, you're impacting neighborhoods.

Steve Ahlquist: It would be all new facilities, updated technologically, and maybe safer as well.

Darréll Brown: And there's deep water there.

Steve Ahlquist: But here's the thing. We do our development city by city and town by town. Providence sees the Port as a place that brings in revenue.

Darréll Brown: Every city and town must submit economic development plans to statewide planning. The state needs to be factoring [environmental justice] in and aligning the plans in a way that makes sense. Whether that's happening at the state level, I don't know, to be honest. That's part of the problem when we talk about economic development.

Steve Ahlquist: That gets me to my big question. If we look at the proposed Providence Comprehensive Plan, we see that it has strong ideas and support for economic development, but only buzzwords and weak phrases that talk about the environment. There's no expectation that if it comes down to a choice between a brand new polluting business or the environment, we're going to go with the environment.

How do we balance those two things? Are economic development and environmental justice fundamentally in conflict?

Darréll Brown: Historically, economic development has overshadowed environmental concerns. The reasons for that have everything to do with job creation. I'm a big believer in job creation. I come from an economic development background. That's what I did for a good part of my career. So I'm not opposed to job creation, but because of climate change and the impacts of climate change, we have to factor in climate impacts. We have to, whereas before, historically, we didn't.

Steve Ahlquist: Was this on your radar when you were working for Cranston or the State?

Darréll Brown: No, it was not it. I had an epiphany.

Steve Ahlquist: Can you talk about that?

Darréll Brown: My epiphany was when I was in Charles County, Maryland, and there were folks in southern Maryland who owned property near the river. Some of the land adjacent to it was in conservation. What happened was that the Board of Commissioners, who were Democrats, decided to place more conservation on top of existing conservation. It was conservation on top of conservation, which then further devalued property owned by a lot of Black and brown people.

Steve Ahlquist: Because no more development could happen there. So if you have land there, it just has to lay fallow. It's like a cheap way of establishing a land trust.

Darréll Brown: Now their land is devalued. They can't do anything with it. These families had land in their families for a very long time. They were hoping to sell and develop their property - and now they can't. So I saw the overextension of environmental work. I saw the overextension of economic development. That's when I had my epiphany. I said, “We can't continue to operate like this.”

Steve Ahlquist: And you can bet that if this had been land owned by white people...

Darréll Brown: ...they would not have done that.

Steve Ahlquist: White folks would have had access to the power to prevent it.

Darréll Brown: That's why we need environmental justice legislation. That was the epiphany. I'd been pro-development, attracting business, and creating jobs. Creating jobs is great, but if you're creating jobs at the expense of the community, particularly bringing in a polluting facility - that's not a good job. Not only because it affects the community, but because it could affect the workers who are doing these jobs. So I started having these epiphanies and I wanted to do something different. That's when I fell into CLF. I wasn't looking for it. I just wanted to do different economic development and didn't realize that this was the way to go about doing it.

Steve Ahlquist: It was 10 years ago or so that I was introduced to the concept of environmental justice, which was explained to me by a 17-year-old. I had heard the term before, but I hadn't thought about it much. That was my epiphany. All of a sudden you ask, “Why is it that the Port is in a Black and brown low-income neighborhood and why does the highway snake through there? Why are there large empty parking lots around the hospitals where there used to be houses owned by Black and brown families and Portuguese immigrants?”

Darréll Brown: Steve, if you were to take a diagram and you look at communities that were redlined and communities that were not redlined, and you overlay that, you'll see how the development occurred, and you will see where the polluting facilities went. You'll see where highway construction went through communities. You will see where bigger parking lots are located as a result of redlining. And as you know, redlining was a policy of excluding Black, brown, and Native American people and destroying their neighborhoods. Not only are you being excluded, but the very neighborhood that you're living in is being adversely impacted, if not destroyed. That is the essence of environmental justice, saying, “Hey, we have to stop this and policies that lead to that happening.”

Steve Ahlquist: Not only stop it, but also where possible reverse it, right? Instead of just rebuilding these highways, why don't we drop them, turn the roads into boulevards, and reconnect those neighborhoods?

Darréll Brown: You mentioned the overpass earlier. 195, the Port and the trucks and whatnot bringing in all of that pollution. In addition to that, there's the machinery in the Port. All of that stuff is impacting the community. Transportation policy - I don't think the current director of transportation is doing any on that. I would be shocked. Because of the Act on Climate, we have to factor climate change into all economic development work going forward. Whether it's at the state or local level we have to comply with the Act on Climate. We're going to have to meet the targeted goals and if we don't meet the targeted goals, then we're not going to have the greenhouse gas emissions that we need to be net zero by 2050 and we open ourselves up to citizen lawsuits.

Don't you think it's upon us to do everything that we can to meet those goals? There's blame to spread around - it's not just on government officials to do this work. Citizens have to get involved. We have to get engaged, educate ourselves, be more aware, and change our behavior. We have to relearn how to get out of cars, for example, and start to use public transportation. We have to have robust public transportation to get people out of cars. If we have robust public transportation, that is a business attractor. Businesses want to invest in areas that have good schools, good public transportation, walkable communities, and communities that aren't impacted by pollution.

Steve Ahlquist: If I had wanted to take a bus to your house this morning, it would've taken over two hours. It's a 20-minute car trip from my house.

Darréll Brown: Then we have electric vehicles, and this is one of the things I'm frustrated with on the government side. We want people to reduce their footprint by getting off of fossil fuels. So we have EVs [electric vehicles]. They can be expensive, I get it. But we need the infrastructure put in and I have not seen it. How many electric vehicles do we need in Rhode Island to begin to have an impact on bringing greenhouse gas emissions down? I have no idea. What's the infrastructure capacity to put in the electric chargers? How many of those do we need? Where do we need them? No idea.

Steve Ahlquist: We just got a bunch of federal money for improving the grid, in part to try to figure out how the grid can sustain the amount of electricity that's going to be needed to charge EVs. But I haven't seen any proof that we know what a modern grid looks like.

Darréll Brown: That's what we're struggling with at CLF. We don't even have a scorecard in terms of what each state agency is doing.

Steve Ahlquist: I think the Attorney General is working on that, but that work might change in two years with a new Attorney General. We don't know if the next Attorney General going to take the Act on Climate seriously.

To my mind, the Act on Climate is a decent bill, but it's a little bit underpowered in the enforcement aspect. The only reason that it's enforced at all, I think, is because the Attorney General takes it seriously. But if he did not take it seriously, I don't think people would say, “If the Attorney General doesn't care, we don't care.” It would just be another Transit Master Plan¹.

Darréll Brown: It falls on the citizens of Rhode Island to force the next attorney general and the governor to take the Act on Climate seriously. It's an imperfect bill. It's an imperfect law, but it's what we have. I would be afraid to open it up for amendments or anything like that because then it could get weakened.

Steve Ahlquist: How about new bills that strengthen it or add some teeth or something like that?

Darréll Brown: You have to be careful because then you can also bring in bills that will take away, right?

Steve Ahlquist: I learned this lesson when Providence Mayor Jorge Elorza wanted to privatize Providence Water many years ago. Other people have tried to sell or privatize the reservoir, but the law that governs the establishment of Providence Water and the reservoir is so old there are terms in there that nobody quite knows how to understand. As a result, people are hesitant to bring it to a judge because a judge could interpret the language and then strengthen or weaken the law in ways nobody wants.

Darréll Brown: Look at Chevron. Now we're going to have judges interpreting or defining what a pond is.

Steve Ahlquist: Off topic: As a lawyer, and you might know this, does Chevron apply to state laws as well?

Darréll Brown: It's federal law.

Steve Ahlquist: So I could challenge state environmental laws, interpreted by the Rhode Island Department of Environmental Management and potentially weaken environmental laws through the judiciary.

Darréll Brown: That is true. We're empowering judges, not only at the federal level but at the state level, to make these determinations. And they're not experienced with that. Typically, they would defer to somebody who understands this, like DEM in the state or the EPA federally.

Steve Ahlquist: I saw this as an anti-science ruling.

Darréll Brown: It is anti-science.

Steve Ahlquist: We have scientists who can tell you with a high degree of certainty what is real and what isn't. But now we will defer to judges, who may have no scientific understanding, deferring to his understanding of God or to his best friend Harlan Crow.

Darréll Brown: And the only way you can sort it out is to go to the courts. Because they're saying that now that they have that authority.

Steve Ahlquist: So our Rhode Island Supreme Court could say that we're going to adopt something like a Chevron ruling for the state.

Darréll Brown: They could come to that determination, subject to having an appeal or review that would allow them to do so.

Steve Ahlquist: I hope Erin Lynch Prada reads this and makes the right decision.

Let's talk about flooding. It comes up a lot in Cranston politics, but it’s a statewide issue.

Darréll Brown: It came up during last night's forum.

Steve Ahlquist: People have been rescued from their streets as their cars stall in giant puddles.

Darréll Brown: There are two things. Last night I talked about our stormwater management system, but there's a piece to it that I didn't speak about. We have to reduce the amount of impervious space put in. We need green spaces and more trees. We have to do that in addition to our stormwater management systems. We must reduce impervious surfaces by having more green spaces.

Steve Ahlquist: To me, it seems like it's an engineering issue.

Darréll Brown: It is.

Steve Ahlquist: Why don't we hire some smart people who know how this stuff works to put in more green space? I've seen wastewater management systems with roads, sidewalks, and a little ditch filled with grass and plants that pollinators like.

Darréll Brown: Exactly.

Steve Ahlquist: There's also this issue that arises when state roads meet city roads and arguments over who is going to do what. Is the city going to reduce runoff onto state roads? Is the state going to pay extra because the city isn't doing its part?

Darréll Brown: And sometimes you get in debates in terms of who owns the roads.

Steve Ahlquist: I hear that too.

Darréll Brown: Nobody wants to take responsibility. They don't want liability.

And you're right. It does come down to best engineering practices. But some people will disagree about what that means. What are good or best engineering practices?

Steve Ahlquist: I'm not saying that every road we build has to be cutting-edge science and technology.

Darréll Brown: I know, but at a very basic level, roads must move water in a way that prevents or at least minimizes flooding.

Steve Ahlquist: Let's switch to economics. During last night's forum you supported, in very strong terms, a wealth tax. There are bills out there and details might change but in broad terms you're supportive. Did you say that in response to one of the answers that Melissa Carden gave at a previous forum?

Darréll Brown: In part, yes, but I also responded because let's be clear, the state needs more revenue if we want to address the affordable housing crisis. We need more revenue if we want to strengthen services for the unhoused, build more shelters, or expand existing shelters.

If we want to think about providing our elementary school kids with free lunches, we need more revenue. Just this week, Bill Belichick made a statement. He said he could not recruit free agents to the Patriots franchise because of the wealth tax in Massachusetts. First of all, Bill, how many free agents are you going to attract? Number two, why can't you pay those free agents to offset the Millionaire tax? The franchise can afford it.

Steve Ahlquist: We're talking about a four percent tax per million dollars

Darréll Brown: Why can't the Patriots offset that bill? And by the way, why are you relying on Massachusetts taxpayers to subsidize your negotiations?

Steve Ahlquist: To be fair - or unfair - sports teams are always subsidized by taxpayers in this bullshit way. It's what we do. We built them a stadium, and of course, we're going to buy them players...

Darréll Brown: The state is going to subsidize the Patriots to get what - two or three players at the most? I mean, come on.

Steve Ahlquist: And we're talking about feeding hungry kids.

Darréll Brown: Exactly.

Steve Ahlquist: Sports economics - the public sector subsidizing professional sports - is a whole thing…

Darréll Brown: I bring it back to revenue because Rhode Island's tax structure mirrors Massachusetts. To bring us back into parity with Massachusetts we need to pass the millionaire's tax. People are going to move for all kinds of reasons, and people were moving before Massachusetts passed this tax.

Steve Ahlquist: I read a whole book on this and I'm convinced that millionaire tax flight is a lie. Here's the thing people don't realize: If I am living in a community and I'm investing in things like Waterfire and local universities and I attend all the best parties and I have my boat docked in Newport tax-free - if I get hit with a tiny additional tax, I'm not going to pack up all my toys and leave all my local connections to move to what has to be, by definition, a crappier state than Rhode Island.

Darréll Brown: And who's to say that state won't do it too?

Rhode Island is less expensive and therefore it will be attractive to folks - but it may not be that way for much longer.

Steve Ahlquist: The education system is more important. If I'm a young professional with a choice of where to live, can I put my kids in Providence schools right now?

Darréll Brown: You would probably have a second and third thought about that.

Steve Ahlquist: You might be a little worried. Since the takeover, Providence Public Schools have gotten worse.

Darréll Brown: And that is an economic development problem as well. So to answer your question, yeah, it was in response to Melissa Carden not taking a position on it. She said she needs to study it or something. But it's already been studied. One of the reasons I want to go to the State Senate is because I believe I can go into that body and be a strong advocate and elevate the debate. Honestly, I don't think that many of the other candidates could do a better job than I could.

Steve Ahlquist: You mentioned school lunches. For at least seven years, since Marcia Ranglin-Vassell was a state rep, there's been an effort to get free school lunches in Rhode Island public schools, to no avail. This year that bill failed again, in part because General Assembly leadership claimed it was too expensive, but we did manage to find a whole bunch of money for Citizens Bank in the final hours of the session.

Then, our delegation to the Democratic National Convention, filled with people who helped kill this bill, are in the crowd cheering for Kamala Harris and Tim Walz. Walz, who famously signed free lunches into law as Governor of Minnesota.

Darréll Brown: Feeding kids is not that hard.

Steve Ahlquist: It's just education. Kids can't learn if they're hungry.

Darréll Brown: That's the kind of stuff that drives me crazy. The well-to-do win when they lose, and everybody else has to suffer the consequences. I'm not a believer in trickle-down economics. It don't trickle.

We have to take a stance and we have to do it now because we're in a crisis. We're in a housing crisis. We've got people living in tents in the woods...

Steve Ahlquist: ...and they're being chased deeper into the woods.

Darréll Brown: Which is just obscene. That's not how you treat your fellow human beings. And then, because they're homeless, we criminalize them.

Steve Ahlquist: That's happening in Cranston by executive order. In Providence, it's just policy from the mayor.

Darréll Brown: I get that you don't want people sleeping on the streets. The challenge is about how you address that.

Steve Ahlquist: Housing people is expensive. Policing seems cheaper.

Can I ask about the minimum wage? We're on course to get to $15, but it's taking forever. By the time we get to $15, it will be meaningless.

Darréll Brown: Devalued.

Steve Ahlquist: There's also the child tax credit in Rhode Island, which is below most other states.

Darréll Brown: That needs to be increased.

Steve Ahlquist: Have you ever been in contact with the EPI, the Economic Progress Institute?

Darréll Brown: I know of them. I have not had many conversations with them.

Steve Ahlquist: Every politician should get to know Weayonnoh Nelson-Davies and learn from EPI because they're ahead on all the issues we talked about: wealth tax, child tax credits, and minimum wage.

Darréll Brown: I would support all of that.

Steve Ahlquist: If you don't know them, get to know them.

Darréll Brown: Okay. Will do

Steve Ahlquist: I know your district is partly in Providence. Yesterday we learned that Providence Schools might be under state control for another three years. How would you characterize the state takeover of Providence schools?

Darréll Brown: First of all, what is the state plan, and how are they doing it any better than Providence? That I don't know.

Steve Ahlquist: Historically, there has never been a successful state takeover of a municipal school system.

Darréll Brown: Exactly. So what's the point of the takeover? Is it smoke and mirrors, saying we're doing something when we don't have a plan?

Teachers have a responsibility to keep their skills and licenses up to date. They need to be the best that they can be so they can influence the students. Resources should flow to the students and teachers. Teachers need to be compensated a competitive wage because it's not easy work. And there needs to be, in my view, a consistent and sustainable plan. It's my understanding that the districts change teaching curriculums, and one district is different from other districts. I think if you bring uniformity to it, that will help.

Steve Ahlquist: You fall well within the Democratic Party platform on reproductive and LGBTQ+ rights.

Darréll Brown: Absolutely. I believe in women's right to choose. Women have lost rights in my lifetime. Going forward, women have fewer rights than their mothers.

Steve Ahlquist: I have a granddaughter, I think about this all the time. She's two years old. What kind of world is this now?

Darréll Brown: It's part of the culture war. At some point, we have to move beyond that.

The same applies to LGBTQ+ rights. People are people. My brother is gay and I love him no differently. He should be able to live his life and be his best self with no regard to his sexual preference. The same thing applies to transgender people. Leave people alone. Treat people with humanity, love, and care. Embrace people for who and what they are. We all have value. Whatever they're doing in their bedrooms, is none of your business.

Steve Ahlquist: I go to a lot of school committee meetings and I'm hearing these Moms for Liberty people speaking against transgender student rights. I don't know what it looks like to enforce the kind of world they want to live in. Do we have to have genitalia checks at the doors of school restrooms? Are we going to profile you before you enter a restroom? It feels very much like a “show me your papers” Nazi Germany kind of thing.

Last question. You're at the doors, you have two minutes to make your case with somebody who's distracted and dealing with a million other things. What do you say to try to get them interested in voting for you?

Darréll Brown: I don't have an elevator speech. Politics is a game sport, and you want to put your best player in the game. You want to put your most valuable player on the field. If you want to win the game, put me on the field and I will win for you. Put me on the field and trust that I'm going to do the job. Put me on the field because you know that you can communicate with me and I can communicate with you, and I will take your voice to the State House and amplify it. Put the most valuable player for District 28 in the State House.

Steve Ahlquist: Thank you for your time.

1. A plan that no one in government takes seriously.